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Untitled[]
"The 10mm SMG in Fallout 3 is only effective at close-range by unleashing a hail of 10mm lead. However, the SMG is next to useless outside of this range."
Anyone else think this is wrong? I think it's pretty decent at medium range. Granted I'm not sniping with it, but saying it's only accurate at close range seems inaccurate to me. Paul (Evil) 20:10, 5 January 2009 (UTC)
- Being as the SMG is not switchable between single/burst (for that matter, neither are the assault rifles), 'unleashing a hail of 10mm lead' is a subjective view at best. Also, there's no scale, so judgment of range is also subjective. I've used the 10mm SMG with acceptable results when I didn't have lots of 5.56 rounds.Shadowgm 20:19, 5 January 2009 (UTC)Shadowgm
- On higher difficulty levels, I found the weapon to be next to useless on any range exceeding a few meters, as many bullets will miss the target and the few that hit deal only little damage. So even while bringing most enemies down eventually and 10mm ammo being very common, it´s not effective as you need to reload constantly, leaving you very vulnerable. Golan2781 15:17, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
Doesn't look like the MP9[]
I'm not the pre-eminent authority on guns, but I do know enough to know that the 10mm SMG doesn't look like the MP9. If you ask me, it looks more like the Czech Skorpion smg.
Kiss0fketchup 21:41, 1 February 2009 (UTC)
- Which MP9 are you referring to? As far as I'm aware, H&K doesn't (yet) market a weapon called the "MP9". This weapon appears to be fictional. (their website mentions no such gun)Fiddlesoup 06:22, 13 February 2009 (UTC)
H&K isn't the manufacturer of the MP9, actually it is produced by Brügger & Thomet. The MP9 is a development of the Steyr TMP (Tactical Machine Pistol). The only difference between the MP9 and TMP is the addition of a folding stock and a picatinny rail on top.
Kiss0fketchup 22:08, 17 February 2009 (UTC)
- I knew about that gun, there are a couple others called "MP9" as well, which is why I asked. At any rate, Fallout 1 predates the B&T MP9 by several years. BTs MP9 was produced first in 2004; Fallout 1 came out in 1997 (the Interdynamic MP-9 and Ruger MP9 were around then, though).Fiddlesoup 16:59, 7 March 2009 (UTC)
Personally, I think that it looks like an M4 Spectre (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spectre_M4) with a curved magazine and the foregrip removed. I think it's grasping to compare it to the Skorpion.
- It's called the MP9 in-game in FO1 and 2. It's not related to the real-world MP9, but it's an alternate timeline. Ausir(talk) 18:55, 17 July 2009 (UTC)
If I were to compare it to any MP series weapons I'd say it looks like the MP-5K, without the forward pistol grip.71.94.63.105 07:51, 18 August 2009 (UTC)
The only mp I know is the mp5 and thats about as far as the mps go. and plus, any mp fires 5.56mm no 10mm so I dont think it really matters its one gun if it bugs you that much use something elseNukacolacap 16:08, December 3, 2009 (UTC)nukacolacap
Visual bug[]
NPCs that carry 10mm SMGs in Fallout 3 will frequently appear in an unarmed pose with the gun floating upside-down in front of their hand. This includes Sydney's unique Ultra SMG. Nymphonomicon 13:24, 6 February 2009 (UTC)
Actually, I think that happens with most, or perhaps all, guns. It's especially annoying when it happens to a follower since they won't be able to fire it anymore and will just stand around taking damage. It's easy to fix, though, by asking the follower about his tactics. Fgibson 06:41, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
Reskinned?[]
The article claims the gun was re-skinned in Anchorage. However, our article on Anchorage doesn't mention any re-skinning, nor can I find a substantiation of this claim anywhere on the Web. For that matter, the gun does not appear to me to have changed. Can anyone confirm that this weapon was re-skinned? If not, that should be deleted from the article. Fgibson 06:46, 23 June 2009 (UTC)
I was wondering the same thing, I tried equipping an Op-anchorage SMG and a regular one to the hot keys and switched back and forth and all I noticed is that the Op anch, one is slightly bluish black while the normal one is grey black. But that could also just be lighting issues.
- Confirming this. It's just lighting, looking through the data files for OA, there is not a reskin for the 10mm SMG.Fiddlesoup 19:51, August 1, 2010 (UTC)
Failure to fire?[]
Have any of you noticed, when the SMG is in bad condition, sometimes when you fire, it want shoot, and he takes the mag out, bang it on the side of the weapon, and put it ind again? saw this a few times, when down to less then 20%
Yeah it's just gun jamming, same thing will happen with almost all rifles too.71.94.63.105 04:12, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
Happens with all weapons that use ammo. Nitty 04:15, 21 August 2009 (UTC)
- wow ive never seen this happening but it sounds amazing detail :)--Replikanxxl 12:34, October 18, 2009 (UTC)
UMP-9 much?[]
A lot of people say that the Fallout 3 SMG looks like a Skorpion. To me, it doesn't resemble a one in any way (besides the folded stock). I'd say it looks like a lot like an UMP-9 (albeit slightly smaller). Here take a look at a picture (the bottom one): [1]
Thoughts?
damage value in point lookout[]
ive heard about some bugs or glitches and ive seen 81 damage value with a not fully repaired 10 mm SMG--Replikanxxl 12:33, October 18, 2009 (UTC)
My SMG's damage is going up and down like crazy.When I got it fisrt,23 damage.Then 43.Then 59.Then 63.Then 76.Then 83.Now it's 91 damage.And all of this fluctuating damages spikes happened on the Pitt Bridge.The further I went down the pitt Bridge,the more damage it did.When I get back to the capital,I'm gonna take down an overlord with this.See if the damage stays the same in the capit-al.I'd like to know. HuangLee 17:26, October 24, 2009 (UTC)
LOL XD I have 10 Agility, 100 Small Guns, Level 21, and it only does around 58 damage halfway down its health 118.136.38.69 14:18, March 14, 2010 (UTC).700nitroexpress
Rename "SMG"[]
I think renamed the article "SMG" is much better, since it's less specific for the future models and the SMG of Fallout: Brotherhood of Steel is a 9mm SMG. Itachou [~talk~] 11:04, June 26, 2010 (UTC)
Weapons Misplaced[]
A few of these weapons included in SMGs are carbines or bull-pup Assault Rifles, and don't really fall under SMGs. If no one objects, I'll move them to Assault rifle. --Revolverman 15:41, October 14, 2010 (UTC)
- Which weapons are you referring to? There are only 3 weapons on this page and I'm pretty sure they're all SMGs. Ausir(talk) 15:44, October 14, 2010 (UTC)
- The G11 and G11e are caseless bullpup assault rifles. The Styer is a bullpup firing the more common 5.56, and the Ruger AC556F is standard layout assault rifle. --Revolverman 15:47, October 14, 2010 (UTC)
- None of those are listed on the page. --Kris
15:50, October 14, 2010 (UTC)
- Uhhh... oops. I meant to post this on the SMG page. How I put it here is a total Derp moment for me. Sorry. --Revolverman 15:51, October 14, 2010 (UTC)
- Wait, this talkpage redirects from the SMG page. --Revolverman 15:52, October 14, 2010 (UTC)
- None of those are listed on the page. --Kris
- The G11 and G11e are caseless bullpup assault rifles. The Styer is a bullpup firing the more common 5.56, and the Ruger AC556F is standard layout assault rifle. --Revolverman 15:47, October 14, 2010 (UTC)
Anyway, yes. If any of them are miscategorized, go ahead. Ausir(talk) 16:11, October 14, 2010 (UTC)
Calico with a stock?[]
Where did that pic of the calico come from? cuz the one in tactics doesn't have a stock in game. 98.209.199.80 21:50, November 12, 2010 (UTC)some dude
.45 Submachine Gun[]
The .45 Submachine Gun in New Vegas IS the Thompson from Fallout 2. So why not merge the two?
- Stylistically the guns are similar and yes, while the guns are based off of the same gun, they are two different guns. The Fallout 2 version is based off of the M1927 version most likely and is fitting for the mobster's vibe. However the .45 Submachine Gun is a hybrid between two weapons, much like how the Automatic Rifle isn't a 100% copy of the BAR and This Machine is the M1 Grand. The .45 Submachine's body is based off of the M1A1 which is the model used by US servicemen during WWII. However the A1 model is incapable of accepting the 50 round drums of the older models. This fact there makes a different, Fallout only version of the Thompson. --Never Rub Another Man's Rubarb 13:45, August 19, 2011 (UTC)
Removed SMGs[]
I figured this page is a type of broad overview for every type of SMG in all of the games, so I don't think its needed to remove some SMGs from the page because they now have specific overviews pertaining only to 10mm or P90s. Devastating DaveZIP ZAP RAP 04:36, 4 August 2021 (UTC)
Pipe gun[]
I don't think the pipe gun belongs here. All of the other weapons on this page are actual SMGs in their default configurations (and any configuration). Pipe weapons don't fit the pattern, are never once referred to as SMGs AFAIK, and are not known to be SMGs.
- intrepid359
8/24/22 12:36am CT - Pipe gun with a stub barrel, automatic receiver, and rifle stock is changed to a pipe SMG. Great Mara (talk) 12:00, 24 August 2022 (UTC)
- That doesn't address the point, and that leads to inserting editor firearm opinions elsewhere. For example, with the right legendary perks, pipe guns could also be listed as missile launchers and flamethrowers. It sounds ridiculous, but you know someone's gonna do that eventually haha. It opens us up to wild speculation, which is why I said that I think the SMG page should be limited to weapons that are SMGs in their default configurations. Every weapon on this page meets that requirement except the pipe gun.
- intrepid3598/24/22 8:42am CT
- The page is an overview for all SMGs. One of its configurations puts them in that category in the game in text explicitly without need of personal user interpretations. Great Mara (talk) 14:29, 24 August 2022 (UTC)
- intrepid359
- The pipe guns in Fallout 4 and 76 can be assigned the title "Pipe SMG" by the game's automated naming system under very specific circumstances (stub/snubnose barrel, some kind of automatic receiver, some kind of rifle stock) but I do somewhat agree; it's a fairly rare and very specific combination of modifications and not the default. -- DirtyBlue929 (talk) 14:49, 24 August 2022 (UTC)
- That doesn't address the point, and that leads to inserting editor firearm opinions elsewhere. For example, with the right legendary perks, pipe guns could also be listed as missile launchers and flamethrowers. It sounds ridiculous, but you know someone's gonna do that eventually haha. It opens us up to wild speculation, which is why I said that I think the SMG page should be limited to weapons that are SMGs in their default configurations. Every weapon on this page meets that requirement except the pipe gun.
Fallout 4 is the first game in the series to have the large scale optional customization system for each weapon whereas the prior games only had fixed types. Ff the game explicitly states that a weapon in the game is changed to a particular categorization of weapon with certain customizations applied, then that bears mentioning them in overviews related to each weapon where pertinent. Great Mara (talk) 20:41, 24 August 2022 (UTC)
To Blue's point, I just checked the FO76 game files. He is correct: with certain combinations of mods, several weapons will be classified as SMGs, including shotguns, pistols, and rifles. We'd have to add shotguns to the list of SMGs for consistency, which I think is a bad idea. Again, I'm back to the idea that only weapons that are SMGs in their default configuration should be listed here.
On a related note, if we keep the pipe gun mention here, we'd have to add unusual designations to half the weapons on the wiki. Laser musket shotguns and such.
- intrepid3598/24/22 8:17pm CT
- What mods change the designation on a laser musket specifically to show shotgun in its designation? Great Mara (talk) 01:35, 25 August 2022 (UTC)
- I think he's referring to non-player-facing designations to be clear; like invisible tags added to the weapon by the mod so that shotgun perks affect it. In this case adding a scatter barrel attachment to any laser weapon in FO4/76 (including the Laser musket) adds an invisible "shotgun" tag to the weapon so that shotgun perks affect it, just like the combination of mods we've been describing makes the pipe gun benefit from SMG perks. Your implied point here I assume is that these weapons player-facing names aren't changed to shotgun but, for example, "Laser Musket Blunderbuss" or "Scattered Laser Pistol/Rifle", which is admittedly valid -- DirtyBlue929 (talk) 01:46, 25 August 2022 (UTC)
- What Blue said is accurate. It used to be more specific in the game files, but they've changed some things around. You can see a couple of examples here for the blunderbuss laser musket and here for the semi-auto shotgun rifle laser gun or shotgun rifle plasma gun. Different combinations of mods will result in just about every ranged weapon being designated everything from a shotgun to a sniper rifle, and other names are there, but you'll never see them due to bugs or because there are so many qualified overlapping designations that low priority designations are hidden. If we stick with the idea behind having the pipe gun on this page because it can be made into an SMG with mod combinations, all of our weapons pages will become so cluttered with bizzare mod combinations that they will be effectively meaningless.
- I think he's referring to non-player-facing designations to be clear; like invisible tags added to the weapon by the mod so that shotgun perks affect it. In this case adding a scatter barrel attachment to any laser weapon in FO4/76 (including the Laser musket) adds an invisible "shotgun" tag to the weapon so that shotgun perks affect it, just like the combination of mods we've been describing makes the pipe gun benefit from SMG perks. Your implied point here I assume is that these weapons player-facing names aren't changed to shotgun but, for example, "Laser Musket Blunderbuss" or "Scattered Laser Pistol/Rifle", which is admittedly valid -- DirtyBlue929 (talk) 01:46, 25 August 2022 (UTC)
- intrepid3598/24/22 9:37pm CT
- That would seem more like ignoring information because it’s less convenient to work with, which isn’t a direction a wiki that should archive everything should be going. A general paragraph could mention that certain modifications result in the type change, then list the specific mods in a dropdown section. Great Mara (talk) 11:42, 25 August 2022 (UTC)
(←) It's more that we've never done it that way, and we couldn't possibly do it that way. We don't have the manpower to do that for one game, much less all of them. It's been tried on a much smaller scale, but there are thousands, if not tens of thousands, of mod combinations in each game.
I'm more favorable to the idea of having a section that points out that certain mod combinations can lead to an SMG outcome rather than having the pipe gun, which is a pistol by default, listed alongside the weapons that are SMGs by default.
- intrepid3599/3/22 7:11pm CT