Talk: Enchanting/Archive 4

A new layout

We should make a drop down menu for the enchantment so it would be easier to find the enchantment for the tools--Dogsteeves (talk) 14:53, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

The enchantments are already organized by what items can receive the enchantment. The Blobs 17:28, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

when I said drop down menu I meant like this http://imgur.com/a/N5gY4 --Dogsteeves (talk) 20:30, 21 December 2016 (UTC)

It's worth considering. Maybe not a drop-down menu, but anyway, some way of displaying enchantments on a per-tool basis, rather than on a per-enchantment basis. – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 20:53, 22 December 2016 (UTC)

The Status effect and Commands pages have brief summaries, followed by a more detailed description. Perhaps we should follow that model. The Blobs 20:10, 13 January 2017 (UTC)

That is a good idea, we should do that! Those formats on those other pages broke us out of the table mould, and for the better, I believe. Though that is still a per-enchantment list, not a per-tool list, right? – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 17:01, 24 January 2017 (UTC)

 Agree — I'm thinking a summary table might have enchantment IDs, Names, and then a column for each significant enchantable item with maybe an enchanting table or anvil in each cell to indicate what's required for the enchantment. That way you could just click on an item in the column header to sort its possible enchantments to the top. There … are actually quite a few enchantable items so I'm not sure if that's a viable long-term strategy (in terms of table width), and I don't think there would be enough space to have both item columns as well as Max Level and a description column, but I think it would work for now. —munin · · 14:39, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

Funny you mention. I'd mocked that exact thing up (User:Sealbudsman/Sandbox/Enchanting_Matrix) last week or so; it works nicely except for how wide it is. And the scrollbar is at the bottom, which is kinda okay, except that the table is tall. Anyone, feel free to play around with it if you like. – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 15:39, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

Would you consider showing the utility blocks using {{SimpleGrid}} rather than {{InvSprite}}? The Blobs 16:00, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

Sure; updated. Also for some reason I had it unnecessarily wide. Now it's about 1200 by 1200px. – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 20:48, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

I knocked it down from a 1200px square to a 900px square, by leaving out the utility blocks altogether, and using {{BlockSprite}} and {{ItemSprite}} instead of {{SimpleGrid}}; added a demo of that to the page. So, space savings are possible. – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 21:04, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

That is a very sparse table. Maybe break it up into two tables: wearable (armor, elytra, pumpkins, mob heads) and usable (weapons, shields, tools)? Basically, armor slots vs. hand slots. A few enchantments would appear in both tables but I think that would be okay. Also, sorting the first column by ID is unintuitive — I'd either add an ID column as the initial sort or just let the name column sort by alpha. —munin · · 15:48, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

True. I made a third and fourth demo; the third was an experiment in minimizing how sparse the table is by combining rows, which, seeing it, I don't favor; I consider demo 4 as my response to your comment. Thanks for the feedback. – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 17:22, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

I like the fourth one as well. The narrower tables also fit on my phone screen without horizontal scrolling. -- Orthotope^talk 20:18, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

#4 layout looks good to me too. —munin · · 20:44, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

 #4 is good The Blobs 22:14, 27 January 2017 (UTC)

 Agree, 4 looks best so far. Can we swap the tables so the larger one is first? Looks better I think. I think we can fit block/item sprites in the cells pretty well, would look nicer than just the colours. –Majr ᐸ Talk
Contribs 07:26, 28 January 2017 (UTC)

I've added Sealbudsman's tables to the page and, um, went ahead and added another summary table I thought would be useful, … and converted the description table to headings. I'd appreciate it if someone would check/correct the fiddly bits, IDs, etc.

I'm not sure if IDs are really needed in the summary table, they're available down in the Data section if necessary. —munin · · 21:17, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

Nice ... Do you know if the notes that say "anvil required for Level V" are complete and exhaustive? I haven't known how to check whether the enchantment table level cap is lower than the anvil level cap. – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 22:13, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

I don't know, sorry. —munin · · 22:48, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

Externals links

Could we link to some external calculators that is updated and therefore a lot more useful (currently the "newest" has not been changed since 1.8) ? Does anyone know of any existing? /83.255.2.175 15:08, 24 January 2017 (UTC)

When did Pocket Edition change unbreaking to durability?

When did PE change unbreaking to durability? It doesn't say on the history and it should be added. Cherryblossom000 (talk) 01:35, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

Jocopa3 may know the answer. Also, please use "Add topic" (Add discussion in the mobile view). The Blobs 04:52, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

In PE, unbreaking has always internally been durability. The enchantment is only called "Unbreaking" in the language files; the game code called it "durability" since enchantments were first added. The reason it shows up as durability when using commands is because PE commands use internal names to represent objects and values, and not localized names. Jocopa3 (talk) 17:38, 25 January 2017 (UTC)

Looting, Uncommon, Rare and Common drops

I had been doing a little digging around in the MCP, looking for the basis for the distinction between Uncommon, Rare and Common drops, or how Looting interacts with these types, and I've yet to find where this is handled. I could be looking in all the wrong places, but I suspect right now that loot tables handle this entirely, which I think means it needs to be rewritten on the Drops page and in the Enchanting#Looting section, and maybe on the mobs' pages as well. Could anybody double check me? Anomie x and Munin295? – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 22:32, 13 February 2017 (UTC)

Fire Protection

I see that "Ongoing damage from being on fire" is not absorbed by armor, and that Fire Protection will reduce the amount of time that the wearer is on fire, but does Fire Protection also absorb damage from ongoing fire damage (as Feather Fall protects against normally non-absorbent fall damage)? Either way, I think that it should be clarified in the description text.

EDIT: After testing, Fire Protection does help reduce ongoing fire damage. I have updated the main page.–Preceding unsigned comment was added by Sealbudsman (talk • contribs) at 3:43, 27 May 2017 (UTC). Please sign your posts with ~~~~

Proposed split/merge

There are two articles that discuss enchanting: Enchanting (this page) and Enchantment mechanics. About 60% of the Enchanting page is taken up by the list of enchantments. What if (#1) we split enchantments off onto their own page (Enchantments, currently a redirect page), and then reincoporated enchantment mechanics back into this page? Would that make more sense? Or (#2), just split off enchantments and leave mechanics as its own article?

There's also Anvil mechanics but its discussion of enchantment combining should probably stay there as the page covers much more and it would be weird to split it up.

—munin · · 15:10, 20 February 2017 (UTC)

This page appears like it could be cleanly separated into 3 parts: a list of enchantments for a new "Enchantments" page, basic material to be added to an "Enchantment table mechanics" page (rename the "Enchantment mechanics" page, that's really all it is), and basic material to be added to "Anvil mechanics" -- what do you think – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 16:43, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Well, I believe the enchantment mechanic is also used to generate enchanted books for villagers and fishing (but not for loot chests?). What would be added to the anvil mechanics page? —munin · · 18:36, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Re: generated books: that's a good point, maybe the rename isn't a great idea. Though if "Enchantment mechanics" describes generated books, and not just how the table works, maybe that fact should go on that page as well; I don't see it anywhere there. For the Anvil mechanics page, there was just that small section, Enchanting#Anvil combinations, though that may be entirely redundant or not, I haven't looked closely. – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 19:18, 21 February 2017 (UTC)

Anvil mechanics already goes into much greater detail about combining items than Enchanting does, but I think it makes sense to leave it as is (because it builds on other material in the article), with details on the Anvil mechanics page and a summary/seemain on the enchanting page. —munin · · 14:29, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

 Oppose The pages for other GUI gameplay mechanics (crafting, smelting, brewing and trading) have complete lists. It would be inconsistent to have the enchantment list on a separate page. The anvil mechanics is different because the non-technical part is on the anvil page. The Blobs 04:47, 23 February 2017 (UTC)

Table

People what have you done? There was a very easy way of identifying what enchant did what and to what, the table was excellent. Now there are some little matrices that make it really hard to understand what is going on? Those pics are so small too - not everyone has 20:20 eyesight. Bad move! -- X septic sid x (talk) 21:39, 19 March 2017 (UTC)

There was a major shortcoming - you couldn't tell, for a given tool, what enchantments can go on it. That info simply was missing and now it's there. Nothing was removed. – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 02:16, 20 March 2017 (UTC)

Late reaction but... I know what you mean septic, the new table seriously takes getting used to, but I'm really with Seal up here; if you let it sink in you'll find the same bits of information, and even more! ShelLuser (talk) 19:04, 11 August 2017 (UTC)

Can we have a list of lvl 30 enchantments?

Can someone please add a list of level 30 enchantments to the "Summary of enchantments" table? It would be useful to know when sorting through enchanted books and planning enchantments. 104.163.128.149 22:40, 7 August 2017 (UTC)

 Not possible Enchanting is not as simple as having a list of possible enchantments for each level. For a detailed description, see Enchantment mechanics#How enchantments are chosen. The Blobs 15:22, 10 August 2017 (UTC)

Bookshelf obscurity

There is one thing seriously missing from this page, and the same somewhat applies to the Enchantment table and Bookshelf pages: no where does it tell you how many bookshelves you need to reach the different levels. On this page it doesn't even explicitly mention that you need them. The page briefly hints at the existence of levels 1 - 30 but that's it. I think that's a serious oversight here, a (new) player will want to know that they need bookshelves to get this working and also how many. Yet neither of the 3 pages involved with enchanting clearly mentions this.

Figured I'd share, I can't make this work right now (enjoying the start of my weekend) but unless someone beats me to it I plan on sorting it out this weekend. - ShelLuser (talk) 19:04, 11 August 2017 (UTC)

The details of enchanting are excruciating, so they've been put on their own page: Enchantment mechanics. But more statements like "See enchantment mechanics for full details on enchantment levels, bookshelf placement, etc." wouldn't be amiss. —munin · · 12:19, 12 August 2017 (UTC)

Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate it! I think I managed to sort this out, added a (small) extra paragraph to get the information about the 15 tables in and immediately referenced the enchantment mechanics. I think it blends in nicely because I directly hooked into the topic of the previous one (enchantment levels). - ShelLuser (talk) 19:19, 12 August 2017 (UTC)

Frost Walker?

Is it just me, or did Frost Walker turn lava to obsidian at some point?

--Accountsoicanusegamepedia (talk) 20:05, 26 November 2017 (UTC)

That was a common suggestion, but no, it never actually did that. – Sealbudsman ^talk/_contr 23:35, 26 November 2017 (UTC)

I remember Frost Walker making lava safe at some point... Guess I was remembering an enchantment from a mod. Oh well. --Accountsoicanusegamepedia (talk) 19:03, 3 December 2017 (UTC)

table not scrollable

The list for obtaining items with silk touch expands beyond the side of the page. I haven't found a way to sidescroll to the part outside of the page. Browser: Google Chrome. TheLOLxd2 (talk) 17:42, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

I've made the "Obtainable with Silk Touch" column a bit thinner and moved the super long text on the silverfish section into the notes. I think that might make it a bit more readable on small screens? My screen is large enough that sidescrolling wasn't necessary even beforehand, but if it's still an issue I think there is a way to force a scrollbar for wide tables. (Also, generally, new sections should be added to the bottom of the page; it makes it easier to archive old ones) --Pokechu22 (talk) 18:11, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

I made the width of the 1st column narrower as well, so even more of the notes column should be readable without scrolling. Hope that helps. – Auldrick (talk · contribs) 18:15, 1 June 2018 (UTC)

Lure Maximum?

The text says "At Level V, the fish-catching particle effects start almost instantly. At Level VI, you are not able to catch anything." but the infobox says Maximum level is III. Can you, or can you not get a Level V (or VI) Lure? Buckosoft (talk) 08:37, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

In the text, it's talking about levels that you can only get with commands, which is basically any number whatsoever, and in the infobox, that's the max level you can get legitimately in the game. It could be more clear about that, now that you mention it. – Sealbudsman talk | contribs 05:09, 21 June 2018 (UTC)

Specatulation?

An IP reverted my edit here, and another IP added info about the new enchants, and then another IP abut the new enchants, and then reverted I to User:Pokechu22's revision using the "revert" link in the popups tool, and i tried to insert summary in the summary field but there came no summary, and then the other IP reverted my edit, and i asking is the new enchantments speculation if they are not shown in snapshots yet? Just to avoid edit war uses I the talk page to discuss this instead of continuing to revert the ip's edit, can someone check if this is specatulation or not? psl85 (talk • contribs) 12:53, 17 October 2018 (UTC)

It is speculation because the enchantments have not yet appeared in a development version. -BDJP ^(t|c) 12:59, 17 October 2018 (UTC)

Enchanting Table Interface

[ This needs additional information, please complete if you are able. ]

The layout is a book graphic on the left with two item slots below and three rectangular fields on the right. (See image)

The left slot (below the book) is for any item. If an item that can be enchanted is placed in that slot, the fields on the right will be populated with available enchantments.

The right slot (below the book) is for lapis lazuli. Up to a full stack (64) of lapis lazuli can be placed in the slot, but only 1-3 are actually needed per item being enchanted. The fields on the right will become active based on how many lapis lazuli are placed in the table: 1 activates the top field, 2 activates both the top and center fields, 3+ will activate all three fields.

The fields on the right have three components to them:

1) On the left is a dot with a number, which indicates the lapis lazuli cost to apply the enchantment(s) from that field.

2) Through the center, filling most of the field, is purely cosmetic. To learn more about this, see 'Standard Galactic Alphabet' on the 'Enchanting Table' page.

3) The number on the right [omitted due to lack of information]

By hovering over the fields, a tool tip will be shown with one guaranteed enchantment displayed. This may be the only enchantment acquired or additional enchantments may be applied. Clicking on an active field will remove lapis lazuli from the slot (based on the field chosen) and apply the promised enchantment (and possibly additional enchantments) to the item. The fields on the right will be emptied, as an already enchanted item cannot be enchanted by the enchanting table. –Preceding unsigned comment was added by 96.55.112.91 (talk) at 20:04, 24 October 2018 (UTC). Please sign your posts with ~~~~

Those details are covered in the main article for the enchantment table mechanics, linked at the top of the Enchantment table section. This page is about enchanting in general. The mechanics of using the table are very complicated; if included in this article they would overwhelm the rest of the material, so they were moved to their own page. – Auldrick (talk · contribs) 01:26, 25 October 2018 (UTC)

Mending

If it is the intent of the information on Mending to say that the XP orbs are first used for the repair of the items and then after that is completed, given to the player as level xp, then that is not how it is working for me. I have been using a pick with mending on it to mine a bunch of collected ores (coal, redstone, lapis, diamond, and emerald) at once, and the pick is not even close to fully repaired. While it is slowly being repaired, much of the xp collected is being sent towards the character xp level, before the item in hand is fully mended. And yes I am ware that using the pick does use up some durability. I am on a server that is currently using MC version 1.13.2.

32.212.102.239 14:42, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

You probably have mending on the armor you're wearing. As the article says, mending picks ONE item enchanted with mending from your main hand, offhand, or armor slots. If that item doesn't need repair, the XP goes to the player; it doesn't look for a different item. So if you're wearing 4 pieces of mending armor, only 1/5 of the XP will go to your pick. If you take off your armor while mining, your pick should repair more quickly. – Auldrick (talk · contribs) 14:49, 26 October 2018 (UTC)

Mending info box

So, under Enchanting methods it's said that mending can only be given to tools through an anvil and can't be gotten from an enchantment table, which lines up with my personal experience. (see following screenshots: http://prntscr.com/lh0ftt http://prntscr.com/lh0gmh ) Under the longer description for mending it also explicitly states the following as well: "Mending is a treasure enchantment, and it cannot be obtained from an enchanting table. It can only be obtained from chest loot, fishing, or trading for enchanted books." When looking at the general explanation, it states this about primary items: "The items that can receive the enchantment legitimately in Survival mode by using an enchanting table. Items of any material can be enchanted (some more easily than others)." and this about secondary items: "Items which, in Survival mode, cannot receive the enchantment from an enchanting table but can from an enchanted book with an anvil." But then in the info-box it puts all items into the list of primary items (see screenshot: http://prntscr.com/lh0h02 ) Can someone explain me why? I also noticed in the changelog it was changed to be secondary but then reverted back. Aren't they supposed to be in secondary items in the first place?

Den_drummer (talk) 16:20, 11 November 2018 (UTC)

Thank you for catching that. You're correct, they should be secondary. It's fixed now. – Auldrick (talk · contribs) 19:20, 11 November 2018 (UTC)